DVC Not worth it

[unixgirl]

Originally Posted by geoffa

If you are not willing to pay full whack, why should you get perks?

See more...

Because you've still invested in Disney - that's like saying people who buy airline tickets at a discount shouldn't be able to get frequent flyer membership. Full whack is very different depending on when you buy in. I'm sure some people who bought in previously paid around the same as resale customers are buying today.

[BevS97]

Originally Posted by geoffa

If you are not willing to pay full whack, why should you get perks?

See more...

Fair enough but The perks really aren't worth twice the price.
We bought resale but early enough to get all the perks but I can't think of any we use. I used to love the the valet Parking but that's gone now.

We have twice booked a cruise but I would rent out my points and use the cash to book the cruise in future

[hornetgirl]

We bought resale last year and feel that even with the not so great exchange rate we got good value for money. When we go on any other holiday we don't regard it as an investment, it's a purchase, so not sure why people would regard DVC as an investment?

[Guest]

Originally Posted by BevS97

Fair enough but the perks really aren't worth twice the price.
We bought resale but early enough to get all the perks but I can't think of any we use. I used to love the the valet Parking but that's gone now.

We have twice booked a cruise but I would rent out my points and use the cash to book the cruise in future

See more...

Disney think they are Bev. I do agree they have been worn way down the years and that is a grouse for those of us who did buy direct contracts. I loved the valet parking. As I have said many times we bought in so we could have the flexibility and we have had some superb holidays because of it. Tokyo Disneyland comes to mind. It was never our intention to do WDW year after year. I recognise that some people do want it for that. I know lots of people go on about using points for cruises etc are not good value. I can only disagree. The last concierge cruise we did would have been $80 more if we had paid cash.

Disney have to do something to restrict resale contracts that they don't buy back and the removal of what you can do with your points was one of them. What if they suddenly said that all new resale contracts could only be booked at the home resort. How would folk feel then? Disney can alter contract terms at any time and would be within their legal rights to come up with something like that. I agree there is no way I would pay $176 a point for new resorts. They are over pricing themselves but take up seems to show that folk still buy direct. The argument that resale purchasers are still investing in Disney is true but they are not investing as much as Disney would like so therefore penalties have been introduced. It's business sense.

And funnily enough we have rented out every single one of our points this year because we wanted the money for non Disney things. I think it may be a while before we visit WDW again.

I think those of us who bought direct or resale back in the day did particularly well - we got $2.05 at the time so for us - these days it's a bargain.

[YorkshireT]

Originally Posted by geoffa

Disney think they are Bev. I do agree they have been worn way down the years and that is a grouse for those of us who did buy direct contracts. I loved the valet parking. As I have said many times we bought in so we could have the flexibility and we have had some superb holidays because of it. Tokyo Disneyland comes to mind. It was never our intention to do WDW year after year. I recognise that some people do want it for that. I know lots of people go on about using points for cruises etc are not good value. I can only disagree. The last concierge cruise we did would have been $80 more if we had paid cash.

Disney have to do something to restrict resale contracts that they don't buy back and the removal of what you can do with your points was one of them. What if they suddenly said that all new resale contracts could only be booked at the home resort. How would folk feel then? Disney can alter contract terms at any time and would be within their legal rights to come up with something like that. I agree there is no way I would pay $176 a point for new resorts. They are over pricing themselves but take up seems to show that folk still buy direct. The argument that resale purchasers are still investing in Disney is true but they are not investing as much as Disney would like so therefore penalties have been introduced. It's business sense.

And funnily enough we have rented out every single one of our points this year because we wanted the money for non Disney things. I think it may be a while before we visit WDW again.

I think those of us who bought direct or resale back in the day did particularly well - we got $2.05 at the time so for us - these days it's a bargain.

See more...

Sorry Geoffa but you are incorrect on this about DVC restricting resale to home resort and being able to change the contract .

Everyone who buys DVC, resale or direct, buys one thing. That is a deeded real estate interest. That is exactly the same, be it resale or direct. If someone buys direct from the builder and seller of the timeshare which is Disney Vacation Developments where they all originate ('DVD'- note not DVC), and sells that deeded interest on to a resale buyer, the deed transfers.

The deed includes a number of rights. This is the interest in a unit at the resort, membership of the DVC club which is the right to book other resorts, home resort advantage, and membership of the main exchange programme which is RCI. These cannot be taken away.DVC is run for its members and has to put its members first. It is a different entity to DVD.

As well as these none removable rights, anything paid for from dues cannot be taken away from resale buyers but given to direct buyers. Which is why silly statements made by some I see, that resale buyers may not be able to use transportation etc are a nonsense- the resale buyer's dues are paying.

So a resort can make a management decision to restrict a facility to the owners of that resort only or DVC owners staying there. A prime example was Top Of The World Lounge at BLT. However because it is paid for from dues and part of the resort which is part of the DVC club, it is illegal to restrict it to resale buyers only when it was opened up to any DVC owner staying on site. Hence why resale buyers also get access. Same with pool hopping.

Now onto perks- do you realise these are pure marketing, paid for by DVD and not DVC? When you buy direct you sign a disclaimer saying the perks do not form part of the real estate interest, you are not relying on them, and they can be removed after 3 years. DVD, the builder and seller of the timeshare fund these for marketing and to try and make a case for spending up to twice as much on a direct contract. So when you visit Epcot Members Lounge that is not supplied by DVC or part of your contract. It is part of DVD's marketing budget paying for it. If you happened to be there for a Moonlight Magic event, it is not supplied by DVC or even Disney Parks, but the park is rented by DVD and you are participating in a giant marketing event.

So when people are paying twice as much for 'perks they need to think they are not actually buying anything of substance. Just marketing, that can be taken away at any time. Also what I never see mentioned is that Florida Statute limits the amount of freebies the developer can give away to a small percentage of the contract. DVD must be keeping a running tally to avoid serious legal implications.

As to using the points elsewhere other than DVC resorts this is generally a horrible use of points value wise. You are nearly always better renting and paying cash, and a savvy buyer would never allow this 'perk' to influence their buying decision. You seem to be aware already given your renting. Of course, resale still get to trade into RCI (cannot be removed it is on the deed), but I wouldn't recommend it. For the latest cost comparisons on using points for cruises, see here dvcrequest/dvc-cruise.asp

Sorry for length of post but I get concerned when I see posts suggesting resale can be restricted as suggested, and that direct is something it isn't. I saved £9000 (50%+) buying resale, a significant sum.

I know you are a very knowledgeable DVCer Geoffa and I certainly agree with you when you say when you bought it was a bargain. The exchange rate was good, direct prices not ridiculous as they are now, and the resale market also wasn't mature like it is now. You did very well indeed.

[Guest]

[QUOTE=YorkshireT;12534986]Sorry Geoffa but you are incorrect on this about DVC restricting resale to home resort and being able to change the contract .

/QUOTE] Ok - I am in the wrong on that one but Disney will try to restrict as much as they can to dissuade resale sales. It's in their interest to do so. I repeat we didn't buy in just to do Disney parks - we liked the flexibility, I even appeared in an Adventures by Disney photo at Edinburgh castle because I had praised it.
I acknowledge that people buy resale because all they want is Disney parks. That is not our case. One perk I do enjoy is 10% off in UK Disney stores and in on site shops. That is worth having.

[MrBlueSky]

This has been a fascinating thread. We purchased a loaded resale in 2010 after 3 years of research and procrastination. We're pretty risk averse. We didn't buy for the perks and the ability to use our points outside of the main Disney hotels. We've been so happy with our purchase that we added on in 2014. The savings have already covered the price we paid to buy in, and we could sell today for more than we originally paid (less costs). The best advice I can give is do your research and don't look at it as a financial investment.

[Guest]

Originally Posted by MrBlueSky

This has been a fascinating thread. We purchased a loaded resale in 2010 after 3 years of research and procrastination. We're pretty risk averse. We didn't buy for the perks and the ability to use our points outside of the main Disney hotels. We've been so happy with our purchase that we added on in 2014. The savings have already covered the price we paid to buy in, and we could sell today for more than we originally paid (less costs). The best advice I can give is do your research and don't look at it as a financial investment.

See more...

Wise advice in these current days.

[Ycryan]

Sorry, can I just check something. Can you claim your tax back from when you buy into DVC? If so, how do you do it and is there a time restriction?

Thanks.

[YorkshireT]

Originally Posted by Ycryan

Sorry, can I just check something. Can you claim your tax back from when you buy into DVC? If so, how do you do it and is there a time restriction?

Thanks.

See more...

Tax? Are you in UK? There's nothing you can claim in UK. In USA unsure. When you come to sell, there is a percentage (was 15 think 20% now) held back for tax as a foreign investor in US property. Most resale agents will put you onto a tax expert who gets it all back for you for $500 or you can try getting all the forms and doing it yourself.