Lightning Lane Changes

[Moorlandman]

Originally Posted by Nimbus

So, it sounds like you are complaining about the cost of the entrance fee, not the cost of Genie+ and IAS.

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My family got 14 days of unlimited fast passes now it will cost hundreds possibly thousands to get the same experience

[YorkshireT]

Originally Posted by Nimbus

See my comment at the end of the post you just quoted.

Yes, the entry fee is a lot more for Disney than Alton Towers. But that's always been the case. This change to introduce Genie+ and Lightning Lanes doesn't change that.

So, it sounds like you are complaining about the cost of the entrance fee, not the cost of Genie+ and IAS.

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We seem to be going around in circles here Nimbus. I’m saying the Disney product is already a much more expensive one- but that was somewhat mitigated by the Fastpass system. Many said ‘Geez it’s expensive, but we get X and Y free’. Now it’s expensive without X and Y free.

Yes this is me griping. Frankly I can afford the extra cost, and may even grow to love spending $60 plus tax on Genie if we can flip between rides in the heaven of a quieter park. But call me a sceptic. I think it’s priced at a level where masses will pay for it, then we are paying for longish Fastpass type queue, and it’s merely sucking money out of our pockets. I will be happy to be wrong.

And I guarantee next year it will be $20, then in a blink of an eye $25.

I paid my £65 at Thorpe Park, (£45 for all the coasters, £20 for entrance on an entrance deal ) and there was virtually no queuing, on one of the busiest summer days of the year. No queuing at all really. And we rode everything. Will that be the Disney experience for 3x the cost?

But it is the cynicism, not only to take away all the other stuff, and up prices, and charge for genie, but actually exclude the best rides which is really the massive kick in the teeth for the customer.

Bob Chapek just keeps upping the prices, and often it is dressed up as something else. The ‘park reservation system’ which is a huge pain in the backside was supposedly brought in for Covid, but he says in the earnings call it’s the backbone of the park system and now allows yield to be increased!

He’s now saying they may look at gambling.

Yes this is me moaning and griping, and I know I can go somewhere else and don’t have to spend money if I don’t like it. But Disney has through its history built a brand that is emotionally connected to its guests and customers, it leverages that, and it is not nice to see that being exploited, as it comes with some responsibility in my view.

[dan223]

Originally Posted by YorkshireT

We seem to be going around in circles here Nimbus. I’m saying the Disney product is already a much more expensive one- but that was somewhat mitigated by the Fastpass system. Many said ‘Geez it’s expensive, but we get X and Y free’. Now it’s expensive without X and Y free.

Yes this is me griping. Frankly I can afford the extra cost, and may even grow to love spending $60 plus tax on Genie if we can flip between rides in the heaven of a quieter park. But call me a sceptic. I think it’s priced at a level where masses will pay for it, then we are paying for longish Fastpass type queue, and it’s merely sucking money out of our pockets. I will be happy to be wrong.

And I guarantee next year it will be $20, then in a blink of an eye $25.

I paid my £65 at Thorpe Park, (£45 for all the coasters, £20 for entrance on an entrance deal ) and there was virtually no queuing, on one of the busiest summer days of the year. No queuing at all really. And we rode everything. Will that be the Disney experience for 3x the cost?

But it is the cynicism, not only to take away all the other stuff, and up prices, and charge for genie, but actually exclude the best rides which is really the massive kick in the teeth for the customer.

Bob Chapek just keeps upping the prices, and often it is dressed up as something else. The ‘park reservation system’ which is a huge pain in the backside was supposedly brought in for Covid, but he says in the earnings call it’s the backbone of the park system and now allows yield to be increased!

He’s now saying they may look at gambling.

Yes this is me moaning and griping, and I know I can go somewhere else and don’t have to spend money if I don’t like it. But Disney has through its history built a brand that is emotionally connected to its guests and customers, it leverages that, and it is not nice to see that being exploited, as it comes with some responsibility in my view.

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100% agree with everyone you’ve said, it certainly made a difference all these little things add up and make the park tickets seem much more worth the value. Alton towers, thorpe park etc are quite poor when comparison. But unfortunately all we can do is moan, or don’t go. I certainly would consider visiting Disney less in the future.

[YorkshireT]

Originally Posted by dan223

100% agree with everyone you’ve said, it certainly made a difference all these little things add up and make the park tickets seem much more worth the value. Alton towers, thorpe park etc are quite poor when comparison. But unfortunately all we can do is moan, or don’t go. I certainly would consider visiting Disney less in the future.

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I know and it’s a first world moan. I could vote with the wallet but like everyone else will probably keep paying. I am quite invested though having bought 4 DVC contracts and we really liked the Fastpass as it was easy to get Fastpasses throughout the day if you knew how to work the system and how the algorithms worked (searching for new ride after tapping in, booking a time, then it would give you another closer time etc)

[Nimbus]

Originally Posted by YorkshireT

We seem to be going around in circles here Nimbus. I’m saying the Disney product is already a much more expensive one- but that was somewhat mitigated by the Fastpass system. Many said ‘Geez it’s expensive, but we get X and Y free’. Now it’s expensive without X and Y free.

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Ah ok.

I mistakenly thought you were complaining specifically about the cost of Genie+ and IAS because that's what this thread was sort of about (kind of). Not about the cost of the overall experience (tickets plus fastpasses plus whatever).

What I was sort of getting at was that if Disney started charging a quarter of the price for it's tickets but kept the cost of Genie+ and IAS the same as it's planning to charge then I suspect many people would probably be okay with that. So it's not the cost of Genie+/IAS that's the problem - it's the high cost of the tickets.

I think what you're saying is that previously people have accepted the high cost of tickets because they've included fastpasses. Now Disney has removed those fastpasses from the ticket and started charging for them and has not reduced the ticket price to reflect the loss of that benefit. And that's greedy and you don't like it. I agree with you there.

Originally Posted by YorkshireT

The ‘park reservation system’ which is a huge pain in the backside was supposedly brought in for Covid,

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Going off at a tangent here but I've noticed that a lot of attractions and places here in the UK still require you to make a reservation. We had a staycation a couple of weeks ago and it's surprising to see that you have to make a reservation for a lot of touristy places that you previously didn't have to. And yet there's currently no Covid restrictions relating to social distancing, the numbers of people allowed in a venue, and the like.

It seems that tourist places just like guests to prebook reservations, possibly for staffing reasons? It's not just Disney that has kept their reservation system.

[dan223]

Originally Posted by Nimbus

Going off at a tangent here but I've noticed that a lot of attractions and places here in the UK still require you to make a reservation. We had a staycation a couple of weeks ago and it's surprising to see that you have to make a reservation for a lot of touristy places that you previously didn't have to. And yet there's currently no Covid restrictions relating to social distancing, the numbers of people allowed in a venue, and the like.

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I had one attraction require a reservation in the UK and that was when masks were still required. All the theme parks here don't require any sort of reservation, and neither do any of the other parks in Orlando. It helps with staffing and various other things, it certainly works in Disneys favor but not the guests favor.

[Nimbus]

Originally Posted by dan223

All the theme parks here don't require any sort of reservation,

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You have to prebook a reservation for Alton Towers. As it says on their website: "Anyone wishing to visit, including Passholders will need to pre-book a ticket in advance as we have reduced our capacity to allow for social distancing. If the date is unavailable on the calendar, that date is unfortunately sold out".

Same applies with Thorpe Park, Chessington, Drayton Manor, etc. You have to prebook a ticket for a set date in advance - so you're making a park reservation. I think the same is true of most zoos and was certainly the case with a few other places we visited.

Note that you can risk it and buy your ticket online (and make your reservation) on the day. But that's also true with the Disney parks. There's currently plenty of available so you can simply do it at the entrance on the day if you want.

[dan223]

Originally Posted by Nimbus

You have to prebook a reservation for Alton Towers. As it says on their website: "Anyone wishing to visit, including Passholders will need to pre-book a ticket in advance as we have reduced our capacity to allow for social distancing. If the date is unavailable on the calendar, that date is unfortunately sold out".

Same applies with Thorpe Park, Chessington, Drayton Manor, etc. You have to prebook a ticket for a set date in advance - so you're making a park reservation. I think the same is true of most zoos and was certainly the case with a few other places we visited.

Note that you can risk it and buy your ticket online (and make your reservation) on the day. But that's also true with the Disney parks. There's currently plenty of available so you can simply do it at the entrance on the day if you want.

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Hmm yes looks like your correct, if I go to one of those parks I'd normally pay for it all online anyway and choose a date regardless pre pandemic as well, so I didn't know that was the only option these days. I guess the difference with Disney is your often booking up many months in advance, and quite often people like to go with the flow and decide on the park on the day, with the parks here you only spend a day anyway, and you'd likely have an idea to what day you are going, so it's not as bad in that respect.

[Nimbus]

Originally Posted by dan223

Hmm yes looks like your correct, if I go to one of those parks I'd normally pay for it all online anyway and choose a date regardless pre pandemic as well, so I didn't know that was the only option these days. I guess the difference with Disney is your often booking up many months in advance, and quite often people like to go with the flow and decide on the park on the day, with the parks here you only spend a day anyway, and you'd likely have an idea to what day you are going, so it's not as bad in that respect.

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Nowadays, you don't have to book the Disney parks many months in advance. That's just what people seem to be doing. Which is fine.

Similarly, they could decide to book their trip to a UK zoo or theme park many months in advance too, but the vast majority of us don't tend to do this. (Mind you, back when numbers were much more restricted and things had only just started reopening, I found it difficult to book tickets to Chester Zoo on certain days - so we did need to book a few weeks in advance then).

I suppose the main difference is that the Disney parks are much more popular than UK theme parks and therefore the risk of them getting booked up beforehand is higher, especially during peak periods.

Anyway, sorry for going off on that tangent.

[kk20]

I would say the cost of tickets and now Genie+/IAS are now linked. However, that being said, £500 each for 14 days access is also the cheapest IF you plan on using those 14 days but many do not so the ticket cost gets to be online with all the other parks.

With FP going in favour of Genie+/IAS then this can absolutely be looked at as a stealth price rise. The planning has now shifted from booking FPs to looking at crowd calendars if you are able to. We are going at the end of August, odds are I wont need Genie+ and would certainly not IAS for a single ride in any case. So if I look at "needing" Genie+ for maybe 3 days out of 10 park days, then this is now a factor and puts WDW at squarely the most expensive park now, even more than Shanghai.

Add to this the erosion of other benefits and we have said one more disney whilst the kids are still with us at home but then thats the lot. The next holiday will be a universal/florida tour and we wont bother with disney (we have already said our goodbyes to DLP after the mess over there with no FP, studios being a quarter park etc).

Obviously those with DVC/AP have an incentive to still go but I would imagine that unless you want to swallow the extra cost as inevitability, you might do the same as we are and look at crowd calendars rather than think "its ok, we have EMH and im pretty handing with a FP"

Touching on Alton Towers, this is a bit of a red herring. AT entry tickets are cheap if you are in the know; you can get vouchers, codes, offers etc so effectively the fast track passes are subsidising the cheap tickets. I look at the overall price on a "day out" basis. For a family of 4 on 100pp platinum passes this would be a hard no for us, but the cheaper levels would be good enough knowing that ive not spent much on tickets in the first place. This level of entry discounting isnt usually seen at WDW

With Universal you can look at the cost of a premier hotel that includes the pass. This often works out at least "break even" if not a decent deal (if you were looking at express passes to begin with).