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Old 10 Jan 21, 09:40 PM  
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Originally Posted by doodles View Post
In no way am I offering professional advice. Let's just say I'm a bloke in the pub you are chatting through a hypothetical situation. Is the kitchen socket supply on a ring? Could someone in the past decided to continue the ring from the socket to the fused spur and out of the supply terminal. If I am reading your post correctly. The white wiring could be from a remodelling.
It's worth checking at your consumer unit to see if the kitchen is on a ring. If you are comfortable doing this and there are two wires going into the breaker consider isolating the supply -either totally - or on that circuit via the breaker and remove one of the wires. Put an isolator block on the exposed wire and re-energize the circuit. If one of sockets you have added doesn't work you know you have broken the circuit. Isolate the supply before putting the wire back in.
If your consumer unit is an old fuse type board and not one with MCBs please be very careful or get an electrician.

Thanks

yes its a old Wylex fuse board, thus we want it changed

Ive put both N and both L in the same terminals of the socket, which resembles the picture on how it was

Ive chased up the sparky who was going to do the CU

it looks like both cables were fitted when it was rewired and had a new kitchen in the 80's as it would have been impossible to have done it any other way with the tiles and the units

Edited at 09:43 PM.
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Old 10 Jan 21, 09:42 PM  
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Originally Posted by mickey house View Post
As an electrician I won't risk giving you advice over a forum but I think you've been extremely unlucky to have had 9 electricians turn the job down as I have never personally encountered that before. I would advise using Checkatrade (if you haven't already).
Seriously, 9 people, a few didnt get back to me,

around here Sparkys are snowed under and just dont want the small jobs

even the guy who is going to fit the new CU has said he has enough big jobs for months
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Old 10 Jan 21, 11:03 PM  
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Originally Posted by mickey house View Post
I didn’t disbelieve you because I retired last March when lockdowns started and I know lots of people put off getting tradesmen in and I guess they are probably catching up now and have a backlog.

I liked small jobs because I only worked part time and jobs like yours were ideal for me, but I appreciate most prefer the bigger jobs.

Fingers crossed you get it resolved soon.
its not fun wanting a small job done, just asked ( well earlier this evening ) on my girls football whatsapp group, got 2 dads who are electrians in our club, messaged both of them, both busy till the summer

i just want it safe now, so hypothetically what would be safe

So I am going with Both N in the Fused spur supply N terminal
Both L in the Fused spur supply L terminal
then running L and N from the load side to a double socket

hypothetically does that looks safe and right ? ? ?

Chasing the guy to do the CU, wish me luck
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Old 11 Jan 21, 02:59 PM  
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Will your home insurance cover you if you have a fire if you do the work yourself?
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Old 11 Jan 21, 03:21 PM  
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It isnt just small jobs. I have have had an electrical job out to tender fr some time now (circa £30,000) and cent even get quotes. We have approached numerous companies and they are booked up way into the future. Trades people really have the pick of the jobs at the minute and will probably have for at least the next year.
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Old 11 Jan 21, 03:36 PM  
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Originally Posted by tspill View Post
It isnt just small jobs. I have have had an electrical job out to tender fr some time now (circa £30,000) and cent even get quotes. We have approached numerous companies and they are booked up way into the future. Trades people really have the pick of the jobs at the minute and will probably have for at least the next year.
I guess it's the luck of the draw where you live and who you call because my neighbour asked me to replace his bathroom light around 5-6 weeks ago and I said I couldn't do it as I'm no longer insured or Part P registered. I told him to try Checkatrade and he got an electrician out within a matter of days (Ruislip West London).
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Old 11 Jan 21, 05:06 PM  
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Originally Posted by MOUSEMARSH View Post
If I read your description correctly the two cables in the trunking are your ring main, which is fed both ways from your consumer unit and hence why they are both live. If this is the case they should be connected together in the socket or 1 to the socket and one to the spur unit with a link in between. If you are unsure then get a sparky in. At the end of the day it should be part p certified anyway. Like Mr Tom I do my own electrical works but have a friend who certifies it for me.
Can I just add to my comments, I am a fully qualified Electronics Engineer and also a Certified Fire Systems Designer, the voltages may be lower but many principals are the same. Anything I have or will do in my house is also certified and checked by one of our 18th Edition qualified electricians who is also Part "P" certified. There are no short cuts I just save money by 1st and 2nd fixing myself, nothing is connected until it has been checked hence my comment about "If you are not sure get an Electrician in as you will need it certified"
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Old 11 Jan 21, 05:18 PM  
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Originally Posted by MOUSEMARSH View Post
Can I just add to my comments, I am a fully qualified Electronics Engineer and also a Certified Fire Systems Designer, the voltages may be lower but many principals are the same. Anything I have or will do in my house is also certified and checked by one of our 18th Edition qualified electricians who is also Part "P" certified. There are no short cuts I just save money by 1st and 2nd fixing myself, nothing is connected until it has been checked hence my comment about "If you are not sure get an Electrician in as you will need it certified"
A Part P registered electrician can’t legally sign off 1st and 2nd fixes you have done. For this to be legal and comply with the regs you have to apply through building control and pay the appropriate fee PRIOR to any work even starting.
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Old 11 Jan 21, 05:39 PM  
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Originally Posted by mickey house View Post
A Part P registered electrician can’t legally sign off 1st and 2nd fixes you have done. For this to be legal and comply with the regs you have to apply through building control and pay the appropriate fee PRIOR to any work even starting.
Hi MH
Dont worry the last notifiable work were the new circuits for the conservatory which I installed as per the regs and was inspected, signed off with a cert as allowed for under the requirements. The only inspection the authority did was on the footings, they accepted everything else without issue. The only other work was not notifiable as swapping sockets and switches on existing circuits, I still got a minor works cert for it though.
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Old 11 Jan 21, 06:33 PM  
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Originally Posted by MOUSEMARSH View Post
Hi MH
Dont worry the last notifiable work were the new circuits for the conservatory which I installed as per the regs and was inspected, signed off with a cert as allowed for under the requirements. The only inspection the authority did was on the footings, they accepted everything else without issue. The only other work was not notifiable as swapping sockets and switches on existing circuits, I still got a minor works cert for it though.
If you installed the new circuits and notified building control as per the requirement and paid the fee prior to doing the work then I'm amazed that building control issued an electrical cert without checking what you did and I suggest you contact them to get it checked. If on the otherhand you installed the new circuits and then got a Part P registered electrician to issue a certificate then building control would believe that the new circuits were installed and inspected by the registered Part P electrician as stated on the electrical certificate then as far as building control are concerned you didn't install the new circuits but the Part P registered electrician did and they would have no reason to question this (unless an incident occurred in the future).

So if you installed the new circuits it is NOT then allowed that an electrician you know gives you a certificate which they would have signed to say 'they' installed the new circuits when they hadn't (thus falsifying the electrical certificate).

It's entirely up to you what you do, but I am just clarifying that a person can't legally install new electrical circuits and then get a friend or any other Part P registered electrician to then test the pre installed circuits and issue an electrical certificate stating they did the installation.

Edited at 06:47 PM.
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