Some * potentially * bad rumours- Now confirmed to be true.

[Oliver123]

We did the tour earlier this week just to see the new cabins& I overheard the DVC staff saying they are now buying back most (70-80%) of all resale due to the new restriction. Most resorts now have fill availability for direct (AKL, BWV, SSR and some other ones.) The staff seemed very happy that Disney were buying so many back

[prugone]

I'm not a DVC member, we 'flirted' with Timeshare many years ago in the Florida and Europe and got our fingers burnt on a Canary Islands scam so never really delved into DVC. Feel sorry for the uncertainty this has caused for all you guys and girls, it seems a very complicated business to me as an 'outsider'. Hope the ultimate outcome is not as bad as painted so far.

[YorkshireT]

Originally Posted by Oliver123

We did the tour earlier this week just to see the new cabins& I overheard the DVC staff saying they are now buying back most (70-80%) of all resale due to the new restriction. Most resorts now have fill availability for direct (AKL, BWV, SSR and some other ones.) The staff seemed very happy that Disney were buying so many back

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Disney have never bought anything like 70-80% of all contracts back. They have upped it a lot last month, buy nothing like 70-80% overall. Whether it will be that high going forward who knows but I doubt it. I think that's what they'll aim for on Riviera and forwards which is why they want to suppress the resale price of that.

[YorkshireT]

Originally Posted by 2point

I've just read an interesting thread on the other place that discussed DVC1 vs DVC2.

It's dated ... 2001. 18 years ago.

There were 6 resorts all with a 2042 expiry. Some quite irate posters claiming 100% that new DVC resorts could not be added with different expiry dates.

What is very clear is the rules will change, like it or not. So this talk of DVC2 is not actually DVC2 at all, it's more like DVC10.

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Interesting but in this context I think DVC 1 and DVC 2 refers to the club. They will I suspect (and I still haven't seen the new Buena Vista Trading Co statement which should clarify matters) have to have an entirely different club for DVC2. All the current resorts are in the same club. There's no separation in that club between direct and resale.
So, and I'm guessing a lot of this I admit, if they have a new club they can place any restrictions on it they want. They can then say if someone from DVC 2 trades into DVC 1, to make it equitable, someone from DVC 1 can trade to DVC 2. However, DVC 2 can have in its rules that only DVC 1 members who bought direct only, or are grandfathered, can trade into DVC 2.
If I'm right about this, they must need enough points in DVC 1 to facilitate the DVC 2 transfers in. Not a problem initially as there may be a lot more DVC 1 members booking to stay at Riviera. But what happens when DVC 2 grows, and more DVC 2 members want to trade into all the other resorts than DVC 1 members, after all they may want to try many of the 14. That's an interesting one.
Also given DVCMC totally control the DVC club, which every member of DVC 1 gets auto membership of by apertuance of their ownership, and given that DVCMC are duty bound to act wholly in the interest of their members who pay DVCMC, why haven't DVCMC insisted if DVD want DVC 2 to trade into DVC 1 (after all that is a necessity for buyers of DVC 2 direct so DVC 1 has all the cards) then all of DVC 1's members get access to DVC 2?
Of course I may be wrong about this structure totally, but I'm waiting to see.

[Oliver123]

Originally Posted by YorkshireT

Disney have never bought anything like 70-80% of all contracts back. They have upped it a lot last month, buy nothing like 70-80% overall. Whether it will be that high going forward who knows but I doubt it. I think that's what they'll aim for on Riviera and forwards which is why they want to suppress the resale price of that.

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I believe this was since the first of January. I think it will be very high this month because of the new restrictions they are implementing!

[YorkshireT]

Originally Posted by Oliver123

I believe this was since the first of January. I think it will be very high this month because of the new restrictions they are implementing!

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Well we will see what they buy back next month on the resale market blogs. It would be an extraordinary turn around, and many trying to beat the 19/1 grandfather deadline would be disappointed.

[act1980]

Originally Posted by YorkshireT

There's two problems.

First is lockoff premium where the guy who has done the whatswrongwithdvc.com website has claimed points can be created out of thin air ad infinitum.
With Poly (and Copper Creek) you have another problem. Hundreds of thousands of points were sold on bungalows which I guess cost well under 500k each to build. Unbelievably profitable.
Unfortunately those points form part of the overall resort points, and how many people bought to stay in them? I suspect hardly any.
So all those points are sold to people chasing studios. At Copper Creek in particular, there are very few studios.
Then what's happened is some those cabin points, after the resort has been sold out, have been put back on studios.
Now DVC are quite entitled to balance points. If a "guide" (commissioned timeshare salesman) told you they wouldn't be changed, this is a basic of the contract you signed I'm afraid. I fully expected studios to go up at some stage.
But I did 12 months intensive research before buying in , and was oblivious to lockoff premium being able to allegedly create extra points out of thin air.
I'm also quite upset because anyone who has studied DVC availability for any length of time, or even looked at Skier Pete's charts, knows DVC 1 beds book last .
So I'm perplexed as to why 1 beds went up. The only thing I can currently think of is because they went up simply because the lockoff premium allows points to be manufactured, allegedly.
What I did expect would happen would be studios go up a bit, they charge more Oct to Dec, less another time (probably summer) and 1 beds come down, and this would balance the supply and demand.
What's happened now seems to make zero sense to me. One of the only 1 beds to get cheaper is the mega popular Kidani value!
So the guy over on his Whatswrongwithdvc.com website seems to be asking questions I'd also like to see an answer to before I can form a valid final judgment.
If however you were told the points couldn't change that's something to take up with DVC or the regulator in Florida, but if you don't have it in writing, good luck proving it I'm afraid.

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I don't understand why they have added so many points to the 1 beds either. There is an increase of 21 points per week for CC in adventure season. As you say, they have subsidised the cabins and penalised the rest of us. I wouldn't mind if it was a couple of points (the 2 beds are an extra 2 points per week) but they are just taking the P with the 1 beds especially

[act1980]

My main concern is the limit. They have added a substantial amount of points to studios and 1 beds which means a lot of people can't go for the same duration so the points they bought no longer work for them. I worry that Disney will do this again in a couple of years making everyones points even less valuable than they are this time around. Theres no security that this won't happen again and thats what concerns me. I know that they can and have moved points around in the past but not at the % they have this time afaik.

[catlady]

Originally Posted by act1980

My main concern is the limit. They have added a substantial amount of points to studios and 1 beds which means a lot of people can't go for the same duration so the points they bought no longer work for them. I worry that Disney will do this again in a couple of years making everyones points even less valuable than they are this time around. Theres no security that this won't happen again and thats what concerns me. I know that they can and have moved points around in the past but not at the % they have this time afaik.

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This is what concerns me too . I'm surprised there hasn't been more up roar in the US? Unless I'm missing it?

Even way back in 2008 when we bought in, we were told points could be moved around but had to equal the same number of points in total for the year? This doesn't seem to be the case now?

There aren't many views of that guy's website and no comments? (Unless you need to be signed in to see them?).

[act1980]

Originally Posted by catlady

This is what concerns me too . I'm surprised there hasn't been more up roar in the US? Unless I'm missing it?

Even way back in 2008 when we bought in, we were told points could be moved around but had to equal the same number of points in total for the year? This doesn't seem to be the case now?

There aren't many views of that guy's website and no comments? (Unless you need to be signed in to see them?).

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I have seen a thread on another forum about a lawsuit. There are a lot of unhappy people out there. I can only assume that what Disney have done is legal, it's just not very moral and loyal. All they're interested in is the $, they don't care about their loyal following of happy (now unhappy) customers. I guess the problem is that we all still go and will continue to invest money so things won't change.

Have you bought anything since 2008? Do you think you will sell at some point?